Folded Napkin In Jewish Tradition

Risposta ad un insolito pistolotto del vaticanista Andrea Tornielli sui "Tradizionalisti"

Inserisco un dato di attualità, sorto dall'insolito e per certi versi inquietante pistolotto di Natale, inopinatamente posto dal vaticanista Andrea Tornielli, sulla questione del cosiddetto "protestantesimo Tradizionalista", scaturito dal fatto che la recente intervista di Tornielli al card. Canizares -di fatto una marcia indietro sulla 'Riforma della Riforma'- ha dato il via, sul Web, al successivo sviluppo di riflessioni e commenti da varie sponde.

Siamo arrivati al punto che si tenta di silenziare perfino i motivati interrogativi e le critiche costruttive, pur garbate e documentate. Ne è una dimostrazione anche l'assordante silenzio da the media 'Catholic' on the recent conference in Rome on the Council, which we started (and continue) the exploration.

Enter my intervention in this context usually submerged in a flood of comments of any kind, including but stand to the Mass in Latin and several others that have given rise to a heated debate. This is the situation in our Church ...
http://blog.ilgiornale.it/tornielli/2010/12/25/la-liturgia-e-il-protestantesimo-tradizionalista/ # comments

Dear Dr. Tornielli,
first of all a Merry Christmas (we are still in time Christmas).
I read with surprise and dismay with his 'tirade' contro i “tradizionalisti”, ancor più inaspettata proprio perché è stata scaraventata sul blog durante il giorno di Natale.
Vorrei permettermi di farle due osservazioni:

1. Non confonderei un certo “tradizionalismo ideologico” da lei chiamato per nome come se esso identificasse tutto il Tradizionalismo, né con la FSSPX né con gli amanti della Tradizione tout court, che sono semplici cattolici che appartengono alla “Chiesa militante” non perché l’ha detto De Mattei, ma perché tutti noi cattolici (lei compreso) apparteniamo alla Chiesa Militante in stretta comunione con quella Trionfante e quella Purgante, e cioè nella Comunione dei Santi , abolita perfino dal lessico cattolico dai neo-protestanti che l’hanno persino espunta dal NO (essi sì davvero protestanti!).
   Questo termine non si addice a coloro che amano la Tradizione , i quali non ‘protestano’, ma ‘supplicano’ che cessi finalmente lo scempio e l’oscuramento delle verità di fede cattoliche. E lo fanno, non “pretendendo di avere la Verità in tasca”, come lei dice, né pretendendo di insegnare qualcosa al Papa né a nessun altro, ma in virtù di ciò che diceva Dom Gueranger: “… quando il pastore si cambia in lupo, tocca anzitutto al gregge difendersi. Di regola, senza dubbio, the doctrine is derived from the bishops to the faithful, and the subjects must not judge the faith in their leaders. But in matters of revelation there are essential points of which every Christian, the very fact of being a Christian, has the necessary knowledge and care required . "
   
   
2. The second point that I would do it and with the his 'harsh criticism', I think his act has f the "vulgate", which is becoming more consistency in the ecclesial reality, ridden by pseudo-loyal to the Pope only in words, which are traditionally only in a moralistic sense for what concerns the family and morality, while the remainder of the tread doctrine and liturgy and ignore all mention of S. And later when we celebrated Father welcomes and encourages and ignored when 'means' and 'correct'. It is they who have 'coined' the term of "with Protestants claim to have the truth in your pocket," and now use it at every opportunity to plug the mouth of those who allow themselves - with the right and duty of Catholics baptized and confirmed - , to report documenting liturgical abuses and doctrinal distortions, even now entered fully in the pastoral diocese of many ...

E ' this one aspect - unfortunately not the only one but the most insidious - of the crisis Today (I think even she would say: "What a beautiful dress has the emperor!") which is not in and of our (no "we-you") Church, because the Holy One is alive and inviolable in his Mystery of Body Monk of Christ and His Bride.

I would add some notations to my reference to "church militant" very precise definition, which seems outdated with underlined reconcile the images of the pilgrim Church "and / or church" sacrament "and" communion "as opposed to hierarchical, teandrica that do not cover the reality - and not just centered on man - Mystery of the Church ...
Given that "hierarchy" implies an "order" based on "community" is obviously correct to say that the Church is a "pilgrim," as it is correct to say that the Church is a sacrament and communion ... moreover it is communion in Christ the Church does, and therefore, if there had always been the "community", even before the council, there would be no more ... the Church point out that this does not mean denying the council, but the understanding of 'continuity' advocated by Holy Father ...

also "Church militant" implies the idea of \u200b\u200ba church that fight, but it is make clear that this is not a struggle with the 'people' ... in short, is not a "church of the Crusaders neither old nor new, but Our battle is not against human flesh and blood, but against the principalities and powers, against the world rulers of this present darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly . "(Ephesians 6:12)

Add an interesting clarification emerged from the debate:

Who made me see that: "the words" pilgrim Church "and" Church community ", although correct, tilting dangerously towards a neo-Old Testament: Chiesa come nuovo Popolo Eletto. La realtà (1Pt 2, 9) è che la Chiesa è “popolo che Dio si è acquistato”, cioè popolo dei Redenti (=ricomprati…dal possessore tirannico Satana!). L’inclinazione ereticale cui accennavo non può che portare ai disastri a cui ha già condotto in ambito protestantico: alla fine, il “secondo Israele” tende a dissolversi, e resta il “primo”!”

Replicavo: grazie per la precisazione. A me premeva la sottolineatura di come i due termini non esauriscano tutta la realtà della Chiesa. E’ tipico delle affermazioni conciliari e relative post-applicazioni fare affermazioni lapidarie, tipo slogan, that strike the imagination and emotion, but do not exhaust the semantic richness of a fully descriptive terminology and dynamically alive in Christ as the "Church Militant and Triumphant Purgatory" and the depth that the ontological identity of the Church requires. Indeed

say really accurate, but incomplete, is passed over in silence what they do not say and that, over time, is buried, buried, forgotten, left aside. I have always noticed that about the Church as "People of God" is not progress but a regression to taste the Old Testament, as the Church and 'first of all the Body Of Christ, His Bride ... is not irrelevant, delete the name of the Lord, and above all, 'veil', dismiss this reality that makes us unique and wonderful in the Church ... He

At this point I would like to point out the increasing evidence of the two (and maybe more, unfortunately) anime recognizable in the visible Church of our time , which is now difficult to navigate and unravel the tangle of misinformation passed off as innovation and spirit of the Council, that the dominant culture continues to weave and carry on, trying to delegitimize any voice trying to 'show' the truth without disguise or Catholic Modernists or a so-called 'new Pentecost'.

And I would also like to underline that these different souls are in fact allied coining the 'vulgate' of so elusive as unlikely "traditionalist Protestantism" itself as "conservative" ... how many labels!

In fact, the 'conservative' today are those who intend to remain so-called spirit of the council doing it - they put in a corner of the dogmas subjecting them to an absurd developments - a new untouchable "superdogma ...

O sservo that the term "conservative" does not fit the Tradition that 'conservative' in the sense that 'holds', the' Despositum Fidei " Apostolico; ma nello stesso tempo non conserva alcun tipo di fissismo, che non le si addice in quanto essa è VIVA nel senso, insegnato da mons. Gherardini, della “continuità evolutiva”, che esclude tutti quei criteri immanentistici che si sono imposti, dall’Illuminismo ad oggi, sia alla filosofia che alla teologia. Gli Apostoli ci hanno lasciato quanto da Cristo avevano ricevuto ratione ecclesiae , non i carismi personali ma le verità riguardanti la Fede e la Chiesa. So di averlo già detto, ma repetita iuvant .
I Padri la chiamano Traditio Dominica o Traditio Apostolica “lo Spirito Santo vi ricorderà tutte le cose che vi ho insegnato I "(Jn 14, 26). The Spirit insufflatio [Present in the Church where there is the Son, there is also the Father and the Holy Spirit] does not cover one or more, but "quaecumque dixero vobis" all things, more acquisitions depth, new and old (Jn 16:13).